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Go Games: How well is the concept being implemented?
Fitter
(3 Posts)
Posted:
08-Jun-2012 10:59
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Folks,
I was wondering (new to the topic and apologies if it has been previously discussed) how well the Go Games concept is being implemented in your area i.e. are clubs with a number of teams fielding 'balanced' teams? Are all players getting at least one half in each game? Are refs focussing on skills? How are the underage coaches reacting to it...etc. etc. Thanks in advance.
Dench
(326 Posts)
Posted:
08-Jun-2012 11:09
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Originally posted by Fitter:
Folks,
I was wondering (new to the topic and apologies if it has been previously discussed) how well the Go Games concept is being implemented in your area i.e. are clubs with a number of teams fielding 'balanced' teams? Are all players getting at least one half in each game? Are refs focussing on skills? How are the underage coaches reacting to it...etc. etc. Thanks in advance.
Kids get plenty of game time. We usually have enough for two teams so everyone gets nearly a full game each time. You get extra points for skils such as blocking down an opponent, scoring off your weaker foot, clean fielding of the ball off a kick-out. One particular blitz they were giving a point for a chip pick up.
Barry
(492 Posts)
Posted:
08-Jun-2012 11:14
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In Tipp,we still have old style Divisional Championships at U12 a la Go Games ie 11 a side with all subs to come on at halftime and play a full half (am all for that).
It's strictly monitored this year (was new last year).
Problem is that some Refs and some Divisions will allow players taken off at halftime come back on in 2nd half for players not already substituted and other Refs/Divisions won't.
You also have the farcical situation where if a final or semi goes to extra time (5 mins a half) Go Games rules don't apply at all and you can sub in & out at will!
Dench
(326 Posts)
Posted:
08-Jun-2012 11:17
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Originally posted by Barry:
In Tipp,we still have old style Divisional Championships at U12 a la Go Games ie 11 a side with all subs to come on at halftime and play a full half (am all for that).It's strictly monitored this year (was new last year).Problem is that some Refs and some Divisions will allow players taken off at halftime come back on in 2nd half for players not already substituted and other Refs/Divisions won't.You also have the farcical situation where if a final or semi goes to extra time (5 mins a half) Go Games rules don't apply at all and you can sub in & out at will!
I think its like that in Clare for U12, not too sure. Im with our U10's
slugger
(91 Posts)
Posted:
08-Jun-2012 12:14
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I've encountered a few problems namely:
1. Arriving at an away game to discover the pitches are not set up or only one 15 a side pitch is set up.
2. Finding out that although we have eg. 20 players (2x 10 a side for under 12s) the opposition have 14 (7 a side is too few for under 12s) and want to play 14 a side which sort of defeats the purpose. (Incidently I've encountered opposition who claimed to have only 14 as being local rivals did not want to include 5 "weaker" players)
3. Referees. Some either don't turn up or turn up late or don't implement the specific go games rules. In short some of them see underage as beneath them and are only there for a few bob. (Doesn't apply to all refs of course)
4. Too many underage mentors are there for their own glory and still have the "win at all costs" mentality. The question "ah sure will we just throw them all in?" from an idiot wanting a 22 a side game to reduce the hassle of organising subs is still also a problem. As is the idea that "it's a 15 a side game so we should play 15 a side to prepare them properly".
Go Games is a great initiative. Great credit must go to those who have worked hard to develop the idea and push it through. Now it's up to underage mentors to embrace it fully.
Barry
(492 Posts)
Posted:
08-Jun-2012 13:22
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Was at U10 hurling blitz this time last year.
All 4 participating clubs had enough players for 2 teams each.
One gobsh*t* of a mentor insisted he was only going to play one 15 a side team notwithstanding (we counted) that he had 23 players!
We all held firm and he had to split his panel in to 2 teams.
Result?...Everyone had a great morning's hurling.
Two weeks later was at an U10 football blitz where another gobsh*t* again said he'd only play 15 a side.
The other two clubs let him away with it but when we played them we made him split his panel into two.
Then,having agreed to split our teams equally,we soon found out he had sent out weak and strong teams against us instead!
But then that same to*l insisted two years previous when we played them in their place in an U8 football challenge that we play 15 a side!
Dench
(326 Posts)
Posted:
08-Jun-2012 13:27
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Originally posted by Barry:
Was at U10 hurling blitz this time last year.All 4 participating clubs had enough players for 2 teams each.One gobsh*t* of a mentor insisted he was only going to play one 15 a side team notwithstanding (we counted) that he had 23 players!We all held firm and he had to split his panel in to 2 teams.Result?...Everyone had a great morning's hurling.Two weeks later was at an U10 football blitz where another gobsh*t* again said he'd only play 15 a side.The other two clubs let him away with it but when we played them we made him split his panel into two.Then,having agreed to split our teams equally,we soon found out he had sent out weak and strong teams against us instead!But then that same to*l insisted two years previous when we played them in their place in an U8 football challenge that we play 15 a side!
There's always a few ignorant prîcks like that
bully bull
(130 Posts)
Posted:
08-Jun-2012 14:55
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They're not implemented at schools level in Limerick from u11 to u13. Its just a competitive competition with a league to begin the year and then broken down into semis and a final. Normal 15 aside rules apply from the off and it can get highly competitive.
There are indoor hurling leagues however and these are small sided games with everyone getting a run.
ollscoil
(2,616 Posts)
Posted:
08-Jun-2012 16:33
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I think some of the comments already made highlight both the strength and weakness of the Go Games. I like that the rules aren't set in stone as it allows coaches to adjust things for the teams and kids they are dealing with. Unfortunately this means coaches with a poor understanding of children can insist on playing adult type games and this can lead to problems.
I coach in Britain so we have problems that are probably not prevalent in Ireland. So while we don't always use the Go Games strictly and may introduce some competitive competitions in the future sooner than we'd like everything we do is child centered.
Every blitz or competition will be full participation and skills are rewarded. Furthermore good technique is monitored,poor tackling technique for example, isn't allowed go unchecked in favour of 'letting them at it'.
I think the Go Games are great and a real improvement on what we had previously. That doesn't mean we can't have some competitions at U12 in particular, but the majority of games should be about full participation and skill development.
On comment I found interesting in the posts above was that mixed ability teams seem to be the norm in Ireland, is that true? We play blitzes based on ability so the best play against the best and so on, I explain to the kids why we do this and I think they prefer this way. I also think that mixed ability games can degenerate into 3 v 3 games as the best kids dominate, even if they are confined to zones.
South Limerick Referee
(16,613 Posts)
Posted:
08-Jun-2012 18:01
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Schools competitions are essentially Under 13 so therefore are allowed to be competitive. Blitzes involving younger age groups are played under the non-competitive model. I have always advocated that for clubs under 10 and downwards should be non competitive, and the two pronged approach should apply to under 12s. This two pronged approach has always been dismissed for no apparent reason only that it is deemed to be unworkable.
The problem with the Go-Games model in Limerick is that it was used as a crutch to settle old political scores, and shaft guys and wag the finger at them afterwards. Therefore the Go-Games model and its merits were sort of tarred with political stains, and I think it has hindered it a bit to this day in Limerick to be honest, because the odd tit for tat battle with the County Board will always have this 'Ye got us to vote for this, and now ye arent supporting us the way ye promised'.
West Limerick and South Limerick had good competition structures. The failing in the South was that Kilmallock and Croom initially and then Kilmallock and Bruff for a couple of years had no competition at the premier grade. Therefore you had a West Division where all clubs were happy with underage game, a South Division where the elite clubs werent happy and City and East divisions were a number of clubs werent happy with the structures.
If they wished to abolish divisional boards, then it needed to be a separate issue and then introduce the Go-Games as a standalone model which would mean that while there would have been some preconceived views, the political element wouldnt have come into it.
2009 was the first year of Go-Games in Limerick, and the Under 12s of that year had played Under 12 as 11 year olds in 2008. Therefore in reality the first true batch of true Go-Games players were up to the age of 12 in 2010 and are 14 this year so this year is the first test of Lifting the Treaty and Go-Games at the Feile and the Tony Forrestal tournament.
Originally posted by bully bull:
They're not implemented at schools level in Limerick from u11 to u13. Its just a competitive competition with a league to begin the year and then broken down into semis and a final. Normal 15 aside rules apply from the off and it can get highly competitive. There are indoor hurling leagues however and these are small sided games with everyone getting a run.
watchthehop
(64 Posts)
Posted:
08-Jun-2012 19:20
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I am involved with u8's.We would have about 30 players at our games.If our opposition have the same numbers then its three teams of ten.If however other clubs do not have the same numbers then we would mix a few of our lads in with theirs so that everyone gets a full game.It is working well so far.
busdriver
(999 Posts)
Posted:
10-Jun-2012 00:11
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we have been through three go games blitz saturdays and so far so good
as the go games rules are in fact guidelines we have found that a bit of tweaking here and there has ensured a good day out for all concerned
for example last week a club turned up with 12 players and so we fielded 12
if everyone compromises a little then we can all get a lot done
in the main the old days off win at all costs are gone bar a few die hards
we can field two teams at any time and if another club fielding two teams is agreeable then we put best against best and seconds against seconds if not then we balance them out as best we can and away we go
the one problem we are having is because of our numbers (34) its really difficult to give every player the individual attention they need in these formative years but sure we will plough on
greenflag
(4 Posts)
Posted:
10-Jun-2012 08:26
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Hi, just in reply to the go games, it has it advantages and disadvantages, and I am sure we won't see it's results for a few years to come. The main aim is participation, coming from a camogie background, a club can often have up to 26-30 players on the line, enough for 2 teams, the majority get a run, but with ten minutes each side, some might not get enough time. The set up for the blitzs take a lot of organizing and this will suit the bigger clubs in the long run, the clubs that have the manpower, I don't know how the smaller clubs will fare out with 11 players and not enough personel to organize to blitz compeitions. Personally the disadvantages are as follows, the GAA is becoming over academic when it comes to go games, less players on the playing pitch, all players on the field of play should be more chances to touch/play the ball, this is fine on paper, I feel that if we are depending on players to get a touch of the ball at a go games blitz when they are 12yrs of age, we are wasting out time. The touch of the ball starts at home,practice, practice in the front yard. In camogie some 11 and 12 yr olds play on 13 and 14 year old teams, so it becomes a bit redundant for a lot of girl, and they are clever enough to know its not a championship game, so they might sit back a bit, I think for camogie, it dumming down the game in the long run, because when the come to the U13/U14 c-ship, it is full trottle all the way, you have to put a huge amount of work into coaching players to strike the ball, etc, the gap from U12 go games is far to big for some clubs to bridge, again go games suits the places with the big populations, where they can field 25 - 30 eleven or twelve year old. I would like to see a shift in camogie as regards the attention the U10's U11's and U12's ( they get lots of games, coaching etc) and put a bit more focus into retaining teenage girls at the ages of 13, 14, 15, 16, playing the game that they all spent so many hundreds of hours playing at the ages of 10-12 yrs, This should be the focus
manfromdelmonte
(2,268 Posts)
Posted:
10-Jun-2012 12:12
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Originally posted by greenflag:
Hi, just in reply to the go games, it has it advantages and disadvantages, and I am sure we won't see it's results for a few years to come. The main aim is participation, coming from a camogie background, a club can often have up to 26-30 players on the line, enough for 2 teams, the majority get a run, but with ten minutes each side, some might not get enough time. The set up for the blitzs take a lot of organizing and this will suit the bigger clubs in the long run, the clubs that have the manpower, I don't know how the smaller clubs will fare out with 11 players and not enough personel to organize to blitz compeitions. Personally the disadvantages are as follows, the GAA is becoming over academic when it comes to go games, less players on the playing pitch, all players on the field of play should be more chances to touch/play the ball, this is fine on paper, I feel that if we are depending on players to get a touch of the ball at a go games blitz when they are 12yrs of age, we are wasting out time. The touch of the ball starts at home,practice, practice in the front yard. In camogie some 11 and 12 yr olds play on 13 and 14 year old teams, so it becomes a bit redundant for a lot of girl, and they are clever enough to know its not a championship game, so they might sit back a bit, I think for camogie, it dumming down the game in the long run, because when the come to the U13/U14 c-ship, it is full trottle all the way, you have to put a huge amount of work into coaching players to strike the ball, etc, the gap from U12 go games is far to big for some clubs to bridge, again go games suits the places with the big populations, where they can field 25 - 30 eleven or twelve year old. I would like to see a shift in camogie as regards the attention the U10's U11's and U12's ( they get lots of games, coaching etc) and put a bit more focus into retaining teenage girls at the ages of 13, 14, 15, 16, playing the game that they all spent so many hundreds of hours playing at the ages of 10-12 yrs, This should be the focus
then you need to play loads of small sided games at training and give players lots of touches on the ball
make the game skill focused - ie give a point for certain scores eg a catch, a block, a hook
Long ball
(84 Posts)
Posted:
10-Jun-2012 12:26
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Green flag, some interesting comments about camogie: do you think that some of the dropout in the early teenage years might be caused by too much emphasis on cut-throat competition, where players left on the sideline get the message very quickly and opt for other recreational options?
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