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Topic: Mr Kielys team for qualifiers. Discuss?
alliance (60 Posts)	Posted: 09-Jun-2012 10:06	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
alliance (60 Posts)	Limerick Leader GAA columnist Martin Kiely picks the Limerick hurling team that he thinks should play in the All Ireland Qualifiers. In a strange sort of way Limerick’s defeat by Tipperary in the Munster Championship could, in time, be viewed as the beginning of a new era in Limerick hurling. Defeat has a way of teaching valuable lessons for those open to learning and change. The management of the Limerick senior hurling team will, at this stage I hope, have reflected on that game, what mistakes were made on the line and on the field. Such reflection must be very honest and the people charged with guiding Limerick hurling have a duty to make sure that the core of the team is sorted for the long term good of the team and the game in Limerick. For the past few years the major difficulty with the team has been that the key positions at full back, centre back, centre forward and full forward have lacked the solidity that is needed to make real progress at this level. Look at all of the good teams and the one common denominator is that the spine of those teams is made up of exceptional players who can control their positions. The team that played against Tipperary showed great heart and passion and none of the players could be faulted for the honesty of their efforts. However, if we are really serious about building a team that can challenge both in the qualifiers and over the next few years then changes will have to be made. This will require the management to make a few brave calls but if they have reflected honestly then making such hard calls will be accepted by the players and supporters. Limerick cannot face into next year and not have the positions I mentioned above sorted. Limerick will only make progress when these positions are in secure hands. We can take the view that, didn’t we do well against Tipperary and why change anything now, but if the management don’t show leadership now they will find the public will be very unforgiving. In this regard I have, this week, decided to try and pick the team I would play in the qualifiers in a few weeks time. Everyone will have their own views but I feel strongly that we have to change for now but, more importantly, for the long term good of Limerick hurling. Nicky Quaid is in goal and since taking up that position he has made it very much his own. As a county we have a number of very good keepers and at the moment Aaron Murphy is his understudy. Some would have the view that Quaid should be played in the half backline and I feel he would more than hold his own here and Murphy would take over in goal. For the moment though I will leave the Effin man in goal. The full backline showed bravery against Tipperary but as the pressure mounted cracks appeared and the foundation for any winning team has to be a very solid defence. Seamus Hickey will come back into the corner and he has the ability to do a very good job. He must however stay close to goal and avoid making long runs up field. Richie McCarthy showed his desire and played well against Tipperary but for a few reasons I think David Breen is a better option. Breen to me is better facing the ball and his size and power is will be needed in the challenges ahead. Tom Condon has made the other corner position his own and is developing into a very solid defender. The formula to success has always rested with the half backline but over the past ten years or so that has even come more into focus. The players on this line can dictate the outcome of the game and in this regard it’s vital that Limerick strengthen this area. For sheer heart and determination Wayne McNamara would cause problems to most but I have decided to go with young Tomas Ryan from South Liberties. He has done well in all of the games up to now and his pace going forward would provide many options. At centre back I have decided on Declan Hannon. This is the most natural position for the Adare man. He has the class to not only defend well but also to contribute three to four points from this position. Gavin O’ Mahony will complete this line and if he can produce what he did in the first half against Tipperary for a full game then this to me has the makings of a stronger unit. It has taken a while for James Ryan to be played with regularity in his best position at midfield and with every game he is getting better. His work rate can match anyone at this level at the current time. His partner Paul Browne has superb footwork and his ability to hit on the run makes him hard to mark. Limerick needs this line to be hitting a couple of points from play and then they will be the complete package. As I said recently picking forwards was never easy for Limerick but that is beginning to change. Shane Dowling will start this line and he has shown great maturity. At centre forward I have gone for Donal O’Grady, this is a role he can player very well but it also provides him with the opportunity to win breaking ball from midfield and as we know he is well able to score. Conor Allis will fill the other wing and as I said a couple of years ago we have yet to see the best of him. The full forward line is possibly the easiest to fill. Sean Tobin has learned a lot from last year and he gave Michael Cahill a roasting in Thurles. Kevin Downes has found his form and with the right sort of supply can do damage long into the future. Graeme Mulcahy will fill the final position and that is no great surprise. Mulcahy is fast building a serious reputation as a forward of real class. The closer we can hold him to goal the better his results will be. The purpose of picking teams like this is to generate debate and no two people will agree on the same team. The team I have picked has a core line of strength that could cause problems for many teams. What was very clear in Thurles is that the bench needs to be added to. Having lads on the panel for mere cover is no longer good enough. For me Tommy O’ Brien from Patrickswell was hard done by last year but he has shown signs in challenge games that his form is returning. With a bit of confidence O’ Brien has the hands and pace to not only come on but to challenge for a starting place. Limerick has a lot of good lads coming along and it’s so important that we start to set some achievable goals. Next year forty years will have passed since we last won an All Ireland but our focus now has to be all about winning the Munster Championship. It takes three years to build an All Ireland winning team but that is only possible when management use sensible and meticulous coaching. Management must be prepared to make the big calls and the set up around the team has to be top class. The County Board needs to provide the sort of backing required and not have management begging for “water and energy drinks”. The qualifiers provide Limerick with a great opportunity and let’s hope we can build on what we saw in Thurles. Martin Kiely’s Limerick hurling team for the Qualifiers 1. Nickie Quaid (Effin) 2. Tom Condon (Knockaderry) 3. David Breen (Na Piarsaigh) 4. Seamus Hickey (Murroe-Boher) 5. Tomas Ryan (South Liberties) 6. Declan Hannon (Adare) 7. Gavin O’Mahony (Kilmallock) 8. Paul Browne (Bruff) 9. James Ryan (Garryspillane) 10. Shane Dowling (Na Piarsaigh) 11. Donal O’Grady (Granagh-Ballingarry) 12. Conor Allis (Croom) 13. Graeme Mulcahy (Kilmallock) 14. Kevin Downes (Na Piarsaigh) 15. Sean Tobin (Murroe-Boher)
staycalm (1,081 Posts)	Posted: 09-Jun-2012 10:21	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
staycalm (1,081 Posts)	Decent bit of writing. Not a single bit of negativity in it. Even with the lads he is replacing with new players, he gives them some nice words. Agree or disagree with what he says at times, thats as positive a column about Limerick hurling as you could wish to see
scelp (1,695 Posts)	Posted: 09-Jun-2012 10:30	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
scelp (1,695 Posts)	Deep bit of self-analysis there Martin. Well done!
South Limerick Referee (16,613 Posts)	Posted: 09-Jun-2012 10:34	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
South Limerick Referee (16,613 Posts)	We were all very worried about Richie McCarthy going into Thurles, but Richie delivered in Thurles. I know one swallow never made a summer, but Richie has earned the divine right to start against Laois.
glasandbán (2,046 Posts)	Posted: 09-Jun-2012 10:36	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
glasandbán (2,046 Posts)	Originally posted by South Limerick Referee: We were all very worried about Richie McCarthy going into Thurles, but Richie delivered in Thurles. I know one swallow never made a summer, but Richie has earned the divine right to start against Laois. Absolutely he did.
alliance (60 Posts)	Posted: 09-Jun-2012 12:47	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
alliance (60 Posts)	If Ritchie McCarty does not start v Laois,it will be very unfair on the man.I was a doubter but he put in a great performance v Tipp.
Long ball (84 Posts)	Posted: 09-Jun-2012 14:51	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Long ball (84 Posts)	I know I'm going off topic, and will probably get slated by the Limerick hurling fraternity, but isn't it bizarre that Kiely completely ignores the Limerick footballers this weekend in his Gaelic games column and instead indulges in a bit of "Fantasy hurling"?? Does he not know that there's a Munster championship game in the Gaelic grounds this evening?
a skanger darkly (659 Posts)	Posted: 09-Jun-2012 14:53	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
a skanger darkly (659 Posts)	Originally posted by Long ball: I know I'm going off topic, and will probably get slated by the Limerick hurling fraternity, but isn't it bizarre that Kiely completely ignores the Limerick footballers this weekend in his Gaelic games column and instead indulges in a bit of "Fantasy hurling"?? Does he not know that there's a Munster championship game in the Gaelic grounds this evening? Fair point. He'll wait til next week to tell the footballers what they're doing wrong!
shoulderghost (238 Posts)	Posted: 09-Jun-2012 16:11	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
shoulderghost (238 Posts)	As a matter of interest, does the Limerick Leader actually pay Martin Kiely for his drivel? Or is it a voluntary undertaking (the writing, not the drivel... that seems to come naturally) on his behalf? I'm delighted that he never mentions our Gaelic footballers. It's the very best service he could ever do them!
glasandbán (2,046 Posts)	Posted: 09-Jun-2012 16:45	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
glasandbán (2,046 Posts)	Originally posted by shoulderghost: As a matter of interest, does the Limerick Leader actually pay Martin Kiely for his drivel? Or is it a voluntary undertaking (the writing, not the drivel... that seems to come naturally) on his behalf?I'm delighted that he never mentions our Gaelic footballers. It's the very best service he could ever do them! Haha! Charity! While this is actually the best reasoned and best written article Mr Kiely has come up with in a while (not saying much) and some of his points are actually not bad, it's still a stupid selection. Why in the name of god would you change around the team THAT much and play so many players out of position for the next match?! Especially when the selections have so far been fairly consistent. Is there really a need to tear up the team sheet and start from scratch? I don't think so. Richie had a great game at full back and he wants him dropped in favour of a player that never plays full back ever? (except under Smiley McCarthy who single handedly wiped out Limerick hurling for two years) In fairness Breen has playing very well at centre back for the club I hear but this is a big difference to full back and he will be restored to centre forward when James O'Brien is fit again. He should be back centre forward for the qualifiers again as I reckon he was only moved out wing to limit the influence of Maher. DOG centre forward where he has never played for the county in my memory. He could be a good option there but we have 4 good options for the half forward line already. If he's moved it chould be back to midfield and that's it.
glasandbán (2,046 Posts)	Posted: 09-Jun-2012 20:34	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
glasandbán (2,046 Posts)	Originally posted by shoulderghost: I'm delighted that he never mentions our Gaelic footballers. It's the very best service he could ever do them! He'll be writing about the footballers now...
dualplayer (18 Posts)	Posted: 09-Jun-2012 20:42	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
dualplayer (18 Posts)	Anyone who thinks Richie Mac is good enough for full back is seriously deluded and belongs to the happy losers group. Tom Condon and Stephen Walsh make hom look by covering his mistakes.
Pete Moss (126 Posts)	Posted: 09-Jun-2012 23:54	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Pete Moss (126 Posts)	Am i mising something here - he says in the body of his article that Tom Condon has made the No. 4 jersey his own and then he goes and picks him at No. 2 on his team? I only hope - probably a foolish hope - that Condon isn't reading the acres of stuff being written about him on this site.
johnny cash (737 Posts)	Posted: 10-Jun-2012 00:22	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
johnny cash (737 Posts)	i thought he played well v tipp at full back. a more critical assessment would be that he conceded 1-2 to his direct opponent, Brian O'Meara. Originally posted by dualplayer: Anyone who thinks Richie Mac is good enough for full back is seriously deluded and belongs to the happy losers group. Tom Condon and Stephen Walsh make hom look by covering his mistakes. This message has been edited - 10-jun-2012 @ 00:22
shackleton (160 Posts)	Posted: 10-Jun-2012 02:16	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
shackleton (160 Posts)	Originally posted by South Limerick Referee: We were all very worried about Richie McCarthy going into Thurles, but Richie delivered in Thurles. I know one swallow never made a summer, but Richie has earned the divine right to start against Laois. SLR - You would make a fine Selector.
South Limerick Referee (16,613 Posts)	Posted: 10-Jun-2012 10:03	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
South Limerick Referee (16,613 Posts)	It would be an awful kick in the stones to Richie if he was dropped for Laois. Breen has played full back once against Aisaki. I would start the same 15 against Laois. You have to show loyalty to them Originally posted by dualplayer: Anyone who thinks Richie Mac is good enough for full back is seriously deluded and belongs to the happy losers group. Tom Condon and Stephen Walsh make hom look by covering his mistakes.
robswindles (132 Posts)	Posted: 10-Jun-2012 10:20	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
robswindles (132 Posts)	Originally posted by South Limerick Referee: It would be an awful kick in the stones to Richie if he was dropped for Laois. Breen has played full back once against Aisaki. I would start the same 15 against Laois. You have to show loyalty to them Why on earth would richie mccarthy be dropped for the laois game after his performance against tipp. I pose a question for you south limerick referee, do you pay much attention to what mr kiely has to say about limerick teams?
glasandbán (2,046 Posts)	Posted: 10-Jun-2012 10:39	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
glasandbán (2,046 Posts)	Originally posted by robswindles: I pose a question for you south limerick referee, do you pay much attention to what mr kiely has to say about limerick teams? At the least, I feel safe in the knowledge that John Allen pays no attention to what Mr Kiely says!
South Limerick Referee (16,613 Posts)	Posted: 10-Jun-2012 11:07	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
South Limerick Referee (16,613 Posts)	None. Rarely read the article in full. So much so that I have only now noticed that he also wants Stephen Walsh dropped. Oh Well.......... Originally posted by robswindles: Why on earth would richie mccarthy be dropped for the laois game after his performance against tipp. I pose a question for you south limerick referee, do you pay much attention to what mr kiely has to say about limerick teams?
robswindles (132 Posts)	Posted: 10-Jun-2012 11:17	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
robswindles (132 Posts)	Originally posted by South Limerick Referee: None. Rarely read the article in full.So much so that I have only now noticed that he also wants Stephen Walsh dropped. Oh Well.......... Fair reply good to see you pay no attention to his thoughts or beliefs.
glasandbán (2,046 Posts)	Posted: 10-Jun-2012 11:19	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
glasandbán (2,046 Posts)	Originally posted by South Limerick Referee: None. Rarely read the article in full.So much so that I have only now noticed that he also wants Stephen Walsh dropped. Oh Well.......... Presuming Hickey is going to come back in, who would you drop for him or where would you play him? Or do you think that he the way the team performed the last day out no one deserves to be dropped and Hickey should get a chance as a sub and have to play his way onto the team? There's a strong argument for the latter option, but then if you want him on form later on he needs game time...
staycalm (1,081 Posts)	Posted: 10-Jun-2012 11:25	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
staycalm (1,081 Posts)	Originally posted by robswindles: Fair reply good to see you pay no attention to his thoughts or beliefs. Nor would Martin pay any attention to his. Or mine or yours for that matter This message has been edited - 10-jun-2012 @ 11:26
lowballs (175 Posts)	Posted: 10-Jun-2012 16:26	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
lowballs (175 Posts)	Why should you show loyalty to players who conceded a 7 point lead with 15 minutes to go? If we were playing Galway or Cork in a quarter final and had Hickey and Hannon fully fit would ye leave them on the bench? Personally I have no interest in what Kiely says and I only saw his article when it was posted on here. His rubbish about Breen at full back will never be put to the test unless he becomes manager so we are safe enough. Having watched the match on tv again I feel that the half back line needs strengthening. Wayne Mac was very poor and was nowhere near Pa Burke when he scored Tipp's first goal. His touch was poor and turned over possession too often. Dodge was in trouble at centre back also when Tipp started to run through the middle and I think Geary was introduced to shore up that area but the horse had bolted at that stage. Now before people start having a pop at me I am just giving my opinion. I have great respect for all Limk players especially Dodge but without a strong half back line we will continue to lose tight matches.
lopper (1,990 Posts)	Posted: 10-Jun-2012 17:31	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
lopper (1,990 Posts)	Kiely has been calling for Breen to go full-back for a long time now, it's not going to happen, I think in this set-up he is firmly a forwards man. I'd agree on the half-back line problems. When are we looking at Seamus Hickey being back? I think it's perhaps inevitable that he is going to end up at 6 in the near future. I would stick with the full-back line that started against Tipp and see how they go with more matches. The half-back line is still a worry you'd have to say. Brian Geary and Mark Foley haven't been replaced. It'd be interesting to see if Geary is played at 6 at all in the Laois match. I'd agree with Kiely on one thing in fairness and that is that Tom Ryan probably deserves a run and maybe should start the Laois game.
South Limerick Referee (16,613 Posts)	Posted: 10-Jun-2012 18:01	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
South Limerick Referee (16,613 Posts)	We are not playing Galway or Cork, we are playing Laois. If they are fit, we can spring Hannon and Hickey if necessary. Both will inevitably force their way in as the summer goes on, depending on the form of those on the field. Hickey may not even be right for Laois, and Hannon did not play a recent challenge game for them and some say he is injured. Therefore neither may be in contention to start. It has to be acknowledged that Breen did a job full back in 2010 for one game but is that enough to warrant dropping one of the defenders now to play him there. Originally posted by lowballs: Why should you show loyalty to players who conceded a 7 point lead with 15 minutes to go? If we were playing Galway or Cork in a quarter final and had Hickey and Hannon fully fit would ye leave them on the bench? This message has been edited - 10-jun-2012 @ 18:02

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