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Topic:
District Court Judge Apologises
Yojimbo
(13,947 Posts)
Posted:
02-Aug-2012 02:17
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http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2012/0802/1224321296119.html
"When the question arose at Friday’s court hearing over whether there was a Polish charity in Ireland, Judge Devins remarked: “A Polish charity? There is. It’s called the social welfare.”.
Its fair to say she had to do a fair bit of wriggling to try to explain it away; not entirely convincingly, as far as I can see:
"She said that the “recent comment in court was made in the context of – and alluding to – another recent, violent, alcohol-fuelled incident”.
The incident had involved “several defendants of Polish origin who were all recipients of social welfare payments”, she said.
The comment was “intended to be specific to that incident and occurrence and was never intended to offend any community, or members of any community”, she said.
“If insult was taken from my comment I apologise for same,” she added."
Yes. Quite
And I wonder what the feminists have to say about it?
KeepOnHurling
(3,223 Posts)
Posted:
02-Aug-2012 02:42
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Originally posted by Yojimbo:
Quite
And I wonder what the feminists have to say about it?
what?
Yojimbo
(13,947 Posts)
Posted:
02-Aug-2012 02:45
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Originally posted by KeepOnHurling:
what?
Is that all?
Bagger Vance
(99 Posts)
Posted:
02-Aug-2012 02:56
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Originally posted by Yojimbo:
“A Polish charity? There is. It’s called the social welfare
Ha
mandarin
(412 Posts)
Posted:
02-Aug-2012 06:00
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Those Ppolish feminists are always drinking and fighting after collecting their social welfare.
Hitch
(3,644 Posts)
Posted:
02-Aug-2012 09:13
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Originally posted by Yojimbo:
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2012/0802/1224321296119.html"When the question arose at Friday’s court hearing over whether there was a Polish charity in Ireland, Judge Devins remarked: “A Polish charity? There is. It’s called the social welfare.”.Its fair to say she had to do a fair bit of wriggling to try to explain it away; not entirely convincingly, as far as I can see:
"She said that the “recent comment in court was made in the context of – and alluding to – another recent, violent, alcohol-fuelled incident”.The incident had involved “several defendants of Polish origin who were all recipients of social welfare payments”, she said.The comment was “intended to be specific to that incident and occurrence and was never intended to offend any community, or members of any community”, she said.“If insult was taken from my comment I apologise for same,” she added."Yes. Quite
And I wonder what the feminists have to say about it?
She's a real stand up comedian alright. There has to be something drastically done about idiots sitting in judgement who have this "I can insult who I like, I'm a little tinpot judge".
How do they get those positions?
masochist
(2 Posts)
Posted:
02-Aug-2012 09:16
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Dont let anyone in Poznan know or they might remove the 'Kings of the Craic' posters
Legalalien
(1,681 Posts)
Posted:
02-Aug-2012 09:37
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She should be sacked immediately. The explanation is pathetic and cringeworthy. However, our judiciary are safe from sacking.
Blanco
(7,909 Posts)
Posted:
02-Aug-2012 10:18
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Were there any Gardai in the court at the time?
Maybe even the Gardai who arrested and charged the defendant in the case that was sitting about his insulting remarks towards polish people , surely their sensibilities would have also been
offended by these unfounded remarks against a race of poeple by our learned judge, no doubt they questioned the said Judge afterwards and charges are pending , no doubt at all.
theface2010
(3,490 Posts)
Posted:
02-Aug-2012 10:23
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What a silly b1tch. This is the type of stuff that makes the headlines here if someone in authority says it about Irish people in the UK or Oz and we froth at the mouth. That excuse she gave just doesn't wash-the judicary in this country sicken my hole.
manfromdelmonte
(2,268 Posts)
Posted:
02-Aug-2012 11:40
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if a member of the public made a complaint about racist remarks...
theface2010
(3,490 Posts)
Posted:
02-Aug-2012 11:50
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Originally posted by manfromdelmonte:
if a member of the public made a complaint about racist remarks...
Just saying like.......
Yojimbo
(13,947 Posts)
Posted:
02-Aug-2012 13:15
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Originally posted by Hitch:
She's a real stand up comedian alright. There has to be something drastically done about idiots sitting in judgement who have this "I can insult who I like, I'm a little tinpot judge".How do they get those positions?
A formal complaint has just been made to the Gardai, Hitch, by advocacy group, The Integration Centre.
Its fair to say that they were not impressed by the apology
Scaoil Amach an Bobailín
(578 Posts)
Posted:
02-Aug-2012 15:15
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Delighted to hear this one has disgraced herself in public. A more self important person you wouldn't come across...I'd say the Guards in Mayo would only be delighted with the opportunity to take her down a peg or two. The gas thing was that the case didn't even involve a Polish National. Surely after a display of racial prejudice such as this, it makes her position as a Judge untenable.
Yojimbo
(13,947 Posts)
Posted:
03-Aug-2012 01:19
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The Times aren't letting p on this one, after the judge was forced to make a second apology
"Judge in Polish row queried cost of interpreters to State"
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2012/0803/1224321372629.html
“So you have been in this country for seven years and you haven’t learned at least one of our languages,” Judge Devin said in a case reported in the Mayo News at the time. “Why, when the country is on its knees, do we have to pay for a Polish interpreter?” she asked.
I think we could call that a classic case of 'foot in mouth'
And how many more skeletons does she have in her closet?
KeepOnHurling
(3,223 Posts)
Posted:
03-Aug-2012 03:05
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I think the world has gone a little too PC to be honest, I'd think that an apology and a warning ahould be enough.
A donation to a Polish charity as a sign of the sincerity of the apology would be a nice touch, and just move on.
However I would genuinely question her cop-on. She is a judge for God sake, and in a courthouse.
Does she really think it's the right time and audience for these type of jokes?
KeepOnHurling
(3,223 Posts)
Posted:
03-Aug-2012 03:06
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Originally posted by Yojimbo:
Is that all?
what do feminists have to do with it?
Bicycle Kick
(101 Posts)
Posted:
05-Aug-2012 13:25
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ONE in four Polish nationals living in Ireland is now receiving the dole, new statistics have revealed, following Judge Mary Devins's controversial remark about social welfare being a "Polish charity".
The extent of the unemployment crisis within the immigrant community in Ireland is revealed in statistics secured by the Sunday Independent, which show that 25 per cent of Polish nationals between the ages of 15 and 64 are on the dole.
The issue of unemployment levels within the immigrant community emerged when, responding to queries in Castlebar District Court about the existence of a Polish charity in Ireland, Judge Devins remarked: "A Polish charity? There is. It's called the social welfare."
The judge was forced to issue two apologies. In hermost recent one, she said: "I unreservedly and without qualification apologise for my off-the-cuff comments at a recent court case. I understand and accept the hurt these comments caused to members of the Polish community."
However, the most up-to- date statistics reveal that the Polish community, who are the largest non-national grouping in the State, are suffering even more heavily than Irish residents from the jobs crisis. Currently, 100,162 Polish immigrants of working age are resident in Ireland and 23,905, or just under a quarter of these, are receiving some form of Jobseeker's Allowance or Benefit.
Significantly, the statistics also reveal that whilst Polish citizens constitute 3.3 per cent of the population aged between 15 and 64, they account for 4.39 per cent of claimants of unemployment schemes that are open to the working population.
It is believed one of the key factors in the rate of unemployment amongst Polish workers, which is slightly higher than that of Irish workers, has been the collapse of the building and manufacturing industry in the economy.
During the height of the boom, the work ethic and skills of Polish workers meant they were actively sought by employers. However, they seem to have been effectively left high and dry.
The statistics reveal that currently 543,961 individuals in the State are getting Jobseeker's Allowance or Benefit, Back to Work Allowance, One-Parent Family Payment or other benefits.
Of the 95,646 people receiving Jobseeker's Benefit, 6,057 or 6.33 per cent of total recipients are Polish. Jobseekers Benefit is paid to individuals who have been in work and earned enough stamps via PRSI payments.
Jobseeker's Allowance, which is means tested, but is also paid to long-term employed individuals whose benefits have run out is currently being paid to 309,885 individuals, 14,051 or 4.53 per cent of which are Polish.
Polish immigrant take-up of the Back to Work Allowance Scheme, which encourages unemployed people (among others) to take up employment is particularly high at 8.7 per cent or 1,044 of the total of 11,955 applicants.
Relatively few Poles, 2.32 per cent or 2,083, are found amongst the 89,735 citizens on One-Parent Allowance, whilst the Polish take-up of other schemes such as Back to Education, Farm Assist and Pre-retirement allowance is even smaller. Currently 36,700 people are receiving such benefits, of which 670 or 1.83 per cent are Poles.
The figures indicate that whilst unemployment levels are relatively high amongst the Polish community, the overall impact on Irish unemployment figures and costs -- 23,905 or 4.39 per cent of the total -- is still peripheral.
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/john-drennan/one-in-four-polish-workers-in-country-claiming-dole-3190040.html
Yojimbo
(13,947 Posts)
Posted:
05-Aug-2012 13:53
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Originally posted by Bicycle Kick:
ONE in four Polish nationals living in Ireland is now receiving the dole, new statistics have revealed, following Judge Mary Devins's controversial remark about social welfare being a "Polish charity".The extent of the unemployment crisis within the immigrant community in Ireland is revealed in statistics secured by the Sunday Independent, which show that 25 per cent of Polish nationals between the ages of 15 and 64 are on the dole.
I would consider that somewhat low, even surprisingly so, particularly in the context of the Judge's remarks and how disadvantaged immigrants would be, in competition with native Irish
Glór na ngael
(1,198 Posts)
Posted:
05-Aug-2012 14:15
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Judge Devins has long been known locally for her caustic pronouncements from the bench, to the extent that she's known as 'The Hanging Judge' in some quarters. But this is probably the first time she's ventured into such dubious territory, with the subsequent statements compounding her folly.
Devins is the wife of former Sligo TD and Junior Minister Jimmy Devins, and sat as a judge during her husband's term in office, which led some defendants in cases related to the Shell to Sea campaign to question her impartiality in open court (not that I would question it, or question her appropriateness to sit as a member of the judiciary). Nonetheless, Ireland must be one of the few states in the western world where a situation can arise in which judges are appointed by the Government, while their family members are serving as members of the same government.
Also, what is it about the judiciary that makes some of them think they can make such prounouncements without some form of backlash? Does the effects of judicial privilege (exempting them from libel and defamation laws while sitting in court) go to their heads? I remember another judge in Mayo making remarks about Nigerians not insuring their cars about ten years ago, and also a judge in Cavan making derogatory comments about Tyrone people more recently.
As for the Poles and unemployment, we all know that Polish men were very prominent in the construction industry during the Celtic Tiger, and would naturally be more affected by the downturn in that industry.
Yojimbo
(13,947 Posts)
Posted:
05-Aug-2012 15:10
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Originally posted by Glór na ngael:
Also, what is it about the judiciary that makes some of them think they can make such prounouncements without some form of backlash? Does the effects of judicial privilege (exempting them from libel and defamation laws while sitting in court) go to their heads?
I'd only ever previously been aware of elderly male members of the judiciary making injudicious remarks; but only from the bench
It might be stereotypical to say, but certainly the abiding impression I get from the more publicly prominent of them is that they come from pampered and/or privileged backgrounds and therefore such personal views that have been reported tend to reflect that.
Or do we have many judges from Neilstown/Clondalkin or their equivalent communities?
let it long
(1,214 Posts)
Posted:
05-Aug-2012 15:23
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Whatever the merits of any particular nationality being eligible for dole, the farcical situation we have whereby any immigrant who's charged with a serious crime being allowed to stay in the state and can continue to collect social welfare, simply has to stop.
Its bad enough funding our own home grown thugs without funding those of other nations. In the estate directly behind where I'm renting currently there are five houses of immigrants that have been raided numerous times in relation to drug distribution and all these schite bags and their families are allowed leech of the state ad infinitum.
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