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Topic: Penalty Points
gudjsus (8 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 14:34	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
gudjsus (8 Posts)	With all the talk today about Penalty Points for not wearing seat belt (amazed btw I can't understand why one wouldn't), the mobile phone usage while driving is stunning. I cannot understand why people do it or why they are not pulled for it, it wrecks my head. Most offenders in my experience are either professional drivers or "learners". What is the justification lads? Why don't the Cops enforce it ? Sorry for the rant but just today I have seen about six offenders and it is ridiculous IMO.
Rebel CNC (4,232 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 14:41	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Rebel CNC (4,232 Posts)	Originally posted by gudjsus: With all the talk today about Penalty Points for not wearing seat belt (amazed btw I can't understand why one wouldn't), the mobile phone usage while driving is stunning.I cannot understand why people do it or why they are not pulled for it, it wrecks my head.Most offenders in my experience are either professional drivers or "learners". What is the justification lads? Why don't the Cops enforce it ?Sorry for the rant but just today I have seen about six offenders and it is ridiculous IMO. They did massive clamp down in Cork about a year ago. Must have been like shooting fish in a barrell you see so many at it. Women on the school run are the worst offenders from what I can see.
Larkin (4,404 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 15:11	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Larkin (4,404 Posts)	In my opinion anyone caught without a belt or with the belt tucked under their armpit, should have the car taken from them. After having had to scrape a few people from windscreens and roads, it would sicken you to see them driving at all. As for those who don't belt their children....they should be forced to re-sit the test after five years off the road.
batter burger (1,950 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 15:25	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
batter burger (1,950 Posts)	Originally posted by Larkin: In my opinion anyone caught without a belt or with the belt tucked under their armpit, should have the car taken from them. After having had to scrape a few people from windscreens and roads, it would sicken you to see them driving at all. As for those who don't belt their children....they should be forced to re-sit the test after five years off the road. It's actually scary to think that there are people nowadays who wouldn't strap their kids in, not too bothered about the phones to be honest as i have to confess that i will usually answer mine and i don't think it changes my ability or concentration, most driving seems to be an autopilot thing anyway for me and I've never had a tip in my 17 years as a driver. I'm just being honest, don't want to ------- anyone off and realise that everyone is different and it only takes a seconds loss of concentration and all that. What were you doing that you had to peel people off the road Larkin?
gudjsus (8 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 15:29	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
gudjsus (8 Posts)	Apologies AFR I just noticed this is under Gaelic Games, can you move?
The Pope of Chilli Town (14 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 16:01	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
The Pope of Chilli Town (14 Posts)	Originally posted by batter burger: ... not too bothered about the phones to be honest as i have to confess that i will usually answer mine and i don't think it changes my ability or concentration, most driving seems to be an autopilot thing anyway for me and I've never had a tip in my 17 years as a driver. I'm just being honest, don't want to ------- anyone off and realise that everyone is different and it only takes a seconds loss of concentration and all that... I would have thought something similar - that a quick phone call would make little difference to driving (especially if you don't have to shift gears) but I watched a programme a while back (Mythbusters or something similar) where they had test subjects drive a car through a course. In the first round, the drivers were all sober and performed fine. In the second round, they all had 3 beers beforehand (cue jokes about how weak American beers are etc.) and in the third round, they all talked on their phones. The ones who talked on their phones did far worse than the other two (there wasn't a huge amount of difference between the sober and ones who'd had a drink but the exercise wasn't trying to prove that). I was very surprised at the result and do try and limit my phone chats in the car in as much as possible. They also said that hands free kits make little difference as it's the actual act of making conversation that's distracting, not the fact that your hand is holding a phone, which surprised me as well (and no doubt pí$$ed off Nokia etc.). If the Gardaí don't police it then nothing will get done as there seems to be very little public appetite to "do the right thing". There was a half-hearted campaign a while ago when the law was introduced but that seems to have died a death. From my personal experience the Gardaí seem to be among the worst offenders (and I know criminals often have the ability to listen in to their radio so I understand the explanation given (though I'd probably challenge how often this is the case)), along with Rebel's observation regarding middle aged women doing the school run, often with the sunglasses on despite the matt grey sky outside.
m_the_d (1,199 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 16:51	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
m_the_d (1,199 Posts)	Originally posted by The Pope of Chilli Town: They also said that hands free kits make little difference as it's the actual act of making conversation that's distracting, What next so, ban talking in cars?
The Pope of Chilli Town (14 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 17:32	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
The Pope of Chilli Town (14 Posts)	Originally posted by m_the_d: What next so, ban talking in cars? Good question. Here's an interesting snippet from the always (ahem) reliable Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_phones_and_driving_safety): Driving while using a handsfree cellular device is not safer than using a hand held cell phone, as concluded by case-crossover studies, epidemiological, simulation, and meta-analysis. The increased cognitive workload involved in holding a conversation, not the use of hands, causes the increased risk. For example, a Carnegie Mellon University study found that merely listening to somebody speak on a phone caused a 37% drop in activity in the parietal lobe, where spatial tasks are managed. The consistency of increased crash risk between hands-free and hand held cell phone use is at odds with legislation in many locations that prohibits hand held cell phone use but allows hands-free. Nevertheless, dialing a cell phone is more distracting than talking on a cell phone, and hands-free devices that offer voice-dialing may reduce or eliminate that increased risk. Comparisons with passenger conversation The scientific literature is mixed on the dangers of talking on a cell phone versus those of talking with a passenger. The common conception is that passengers are able to better regulate conversation based on the perceived level of danger, therefore the risk is negligible. A study by a University of South Carolina psychology researcher featured in the journal, Experimental Psychology, found that planning to speak and speaking put far more demands on the brain’s resources than listening. Measurement of attention levels showed that subjects were four times more distracted while preparing to speak or speaking than when they were listening. The Accident Research Unit at the University of Nottingham found that the number of utterances was usually higher for mobile calls when compared to blindfolded and non-blindfolded passengers across various driving conditions. The number of questions asked averaged slightly higher for mobile phone conversations, although results were not constant across road types and largely influenced by a large number of questions on the urban roads. A 2004 University of Utah simulation study that compared passenger and cell-phone conversations concluded that the driver performs better when conversing with a passenger because the traffic and driving task become part of the conversation. Drivers holding conversations on cell phones were four times more likely to miss the highway exit than those with passengers, and drivers conversing with passengers showed no statistically significant difference from lone drivers in the simulator. A study led by Andrew Parkes at the Transport Research Laboratory, also with a driving simulator, concluded that hands-free phone conversations impair driving performance more than other common in-vehicle distractions such as passenger conversations. However, some have criticized the use of simulation studies to measure the risk of cell-phone use while driving since the studies may be impacted by the Hawthorne effect. In contrast, the University of Illinois meta-analysis concluded that passenger conversations were just as costly to driving performance as cell phone ones. AAA ranks passengers as the third most reported cause of distraction-related accidents at 11 percent, compared to 1.5 percent for cellular telephones. A simulation study funded by the American Transportation Research Board concluded that driving events that require urgent responses may be influenced by in-vehicle conversations, and that there is little practical evidence that passengers adjusted their conversations to changes in the traffic. It concluded that drivers' training should address the hazards of both mobile phone and passenger conversations. Or a similar vein on the subject: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/05/080531084958.htm It seems conversations of any kind affect driving but those using a phone, handsfree or not, are even more distracting.
loughcurraman (1,456 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 21:09	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
loughcurraman (1,456 Posts)	Originally posted by m_the_d: What next so, ban talking in cars? Yes , and no cd player or car radios either!
Roger Mulligan (41 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 21:31	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Roger Mulligan (41 Posts)	A lot of lads getting over excited here. A bloke in work was telling me during the week how he rolled the car going home from the pub a few years ago and the only thing that saved him was not having the seatbelt on as he reckons he was able escape easily enough before the car setfire. Could it be true lads? Yerman is usually full of dung, pinch of salt type but another lad who is a top top bloke confirmed the story so he did. Have ye heard this at all lads? I'd wear the belt under the arm myself as I get a rash on my chest otherwise.
parish man (1,457 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 21:45	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
parish man (1,457 Posts)	often thought about this and is smokin a cigarette while driving not as dangerous as holdin a phone.. or eatin a cone as i have seen recently. your not in control of your car either
Sa Bhaile (1,797 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 21:48	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Sa Bhaile (1,797 Posts)	Originally posted by Roger Mulligan: ... I'd wear the belt under the arm myself as I get a rash on my chest otherwise. You should try a larger bra size, Roger. I heard from a Japanese chap who seemed to be a top bloke that it solved the rash on his chest. I'm only going on what I heard now Roger. What do ye think lads? Would a larger bra size help Roger out at all at all?
Roger Mulligan (41 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 22:02	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Roger Mulligan (41 Posts)	Sa Bhaile, I often tried on the wife's knickers when she went out for the night. No shame in that. It was in the early days. Would you do a hit of cross dressing yourself at all? A bloke in the pub wad telling me one time his brother in law did a bit of it. Don't know how true that is as I never met the man before or after. Do we have any cross dressers posting here lads? Anyone at all?
Sa Bhaile (1,797 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 22:38	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Sa Bhaile (1,797 Posts)	Same as that, Roger. Although I don't think I could be called a cross dresser as I get very placid and submissive. The wife though! Now there's a cross dresser! She gets pure wicked altogether. Especially if I leave skid marks on her knickers. Anyway, sorry to be boring you with this private stuff, Roger. I don't know if antone ever told you but you're a top top bloke.
South Limerick Referee (16,613 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 22:40	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
South Limerick Referee (16,613 Posts)	A handsfree kit costs 200 euro including installation to wire through the radio speakers and its actually standard in some modern cars. I cannot understand why people do not use them. I have had one since 2000 This message has been edited - 02-aug-2012 @ 22:41
Sa Bhaile (1,797 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 22:57	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Sa Bhaile (1,797 Posts)	Originally posted by South Limerick Referee: A handsfree kit costs 200 euro including installation to wire through the radio speakers and its actually standard in some modern cars. I cannot understand why people do not use them. I have had one since 2000 I got one installed at my employer's expense when I was on the road a fair bit. But if I recall, there were many different types that time, depending on what model or make of phone you had. Have things been standardised any bit since then? 200 euro is big bucks enough for a private citizen in these times but it's worth it provided that you don't have to change the car kit every time you change your phone.
Roger Mulligan (41 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 22:59	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Roger Mulligan (41 Posts)	Sa bhaile, your woman sounds like a top top bit of stuff.
Bagger Vance (99 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 23:07	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Bagger Vance (99 Posts)	Originally posted by South Limerick Referee: A handsfree kit costs 200 euro including installation to wire through the radio speakers and its actually standard in some modern cars. I cannot understand why people do not use them. I have had one since 2000 Bluetooth is standard on most cars headunits now, even low end aftermarket headunits have bluetooth. No need to be running wires around your car, thats old school nowadays.
cerebus (3,258 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 23:20	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
cerebus (3,258 Posts)	Originally posted by loughcurraman: Yes , and no cd player or car radios either! Back in the day a heater was an optional extra.
Larkin (4,404 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 23:23	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Larkin (4,404 Posts)	What were you doing that you had to peel people off the road Larkin? I'm an EMT and hoping to become a full blown paramedic at some stage. When training I had to deal with many car crashes and the mess in some of them is something to behold. I Firmly believe that if people saw the half of what the emergency services see on a regular basis they wouldn't be so quick to act the bollix on the roads. I really pity Gardaí who are the ones to have to deliver the news to families at all hours of the morning. I also got to work in theatre on the victims of crashes and to see what has to be done to keep people alive is unbelievable. As for Roger, let me tell you a story. I was at a crash once and the driver was dead. There was no mark on him and the car was not damaged enough to have been the cause of death. I found afterwards that his liver had been severed and the man bled out in seconds. He felt nothing. I know you are a WUM but for Jesus' sake, do not advocate wearing the seatbelt like that.
Bagger Vance (99 Posts)	Posted: 02-Aug-2012 23:52	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Bagger Vance (99 Posts)	Originally posted by Larkin: I'm an EMT Is that like a nurse, but in an ambulance?
craichoor (882 Posts)	Posted: 03-Aug-2012 00:44	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
craichoor (882 Posts)	Originally posted by Larkin: I'm an EMT and hoping to become a full blown paramedic at some stage. When training I had to deal with many car crashes and the mess in some of them is something to behold. I Firmly believe that if people saw the half of what the emergency services see on a regular basis they wouldn't be so quick to act the bollix on the roads. I really pity Gardaí who are the ones to have to deliver the news to families at all hours of the morning.I also got to work in theatre on the victims of crashes and to see what has to be done to keep people alive is unbelievable.As for Roger, let me tell you a story. I was at a crash once and the driver was dead. There was no mark on him and the car was not damaged enough to have been the cause of death. I found afterwards that his liver had been severed and the man bled out in seconds. He felt nothing. I know you are a WUM but for Jesus' sake, do not advocate wearing the seatbelt like that. 1. I heard the exact same about wearing the seatbelt under the arm. I heard that it can sever your arm. Any truth in that? I hate to make generalisations but it always seems that it's the boy-racer types (or idiots) that tend to wear the seatbelt under arm. 2. Can you be a paramedic in Ireland? As in, isn't a paramedic an EMT that's able to prescribe certain drugs? 3. Could you explain the difference between EMT-B and EMT-A? 4. Do you know many foreign trained EMTs working in Ireland?
Larkin (4,404 Posts)	Posted: 03-Aug-2012 13:58	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Larkin (4,404 Posts)	Originally posted by Bagger Vance: Is that like a nurse, but in an ambulance? A fair way to describe it. However, I do not work with the HSE which is a pity. Everyone in the HSE emergency ambulances are now paramedics and EMT's only do patient transport.
Larkin (4,404 Posts)	Posted: 03-Aug-2012 14:16	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Larkin (4,404 Posts)	Originally posted by craichoor: 1. I heard the exact same about wearing the seatbelt under the arm. I heard that it can sever your arm. Any truth in that? I hate to make generalisations but it always seems that it's the boy-racer types (or idiots) that tend to wear the seatbelt under arm.2. Can you be a paramedic in Ireland? As in, isn't a paramedic an EMT that's able to prescribe certain drugs? 3. Could you explain the difference between EMT-B and EMT-A?4. Do you know many foreign trained EMTs working in Ireland? 1. It is almost as bad as not wearing a belt for sure. Anyone who has experience in emergency services will tell you the same. The liver because of where it is will bear the brunt of the damage and because it is a very vascular organ you bleed out very quickly. 2.No emergency personnel can prescribe medicine, that is the job of doctors. However all such staff are licensed to administer medicine to patients, something that nurses are not. As far as I know nurses cannot even turn up the flow of oxygen to a patient without the say so of a doctor. 3. These are terms that apply to American personnel. Here, you have EMT, Paramedic and Advanced Paramedic. The difference is the skill set and training. From each of those you are trained to administer 9, 16 and 36 drugs respectively although this changes from time to time as do the Clinical Practitioner Guidelines which is the bible that each uses. As you go through patient assessment you may reach a point at which you need extra help that is beyond you and here you will always call someone more qualified. Our job is to get to a patient while he is alive, stabilise him and keep him alive and package him ready for transport so that at handover in A&E he is still alive and in the best possible shape he could be. It is stressful but brilliant work with horror stories to be told but also some great ones as well. 4. Yes I do know some foreign lads working here. The lad that trained me was the American equivalent of our AP but they regraded him down three steps so on paper he is at the same level as me. This is crazy because he has a lot to offer but they just won't let him. The other crazy thing is that we take so many of our guidelines from the yanks but we will not accept their training!!! Go figure, but we have an awful sense of our own importance at times. Incidentally you must be licensed through the Pre-Hospital Emergency Care Council PHECC. Work out the pronunciation yourself but someone has a sense of humour. I remember one of the bosses telling us that when we were qualified, you would be known as a PHECCer. Out of curiosity, why do you ask?
theblack&amber (593 Posts)	Posted: 03-Aug-2012 14:48	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
theblack&amber (593 Posts)	I often see women putting on makeup while looking in the mirror on the motorway. I would regard that as more dangerous than not wearing a seatbelt as their attention isn't even on the road. Also people who don't speed up to join motorway's, instead waiting to be on the motorway to speed up. There's nothing worse than having to slow down to 60kph because of some eejit when you can't go on the overtaking lane due to traffic. Its dangerous too.

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