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Topic: Letter in the Indo today, raining on the hurling parade
deiseach (5,099 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 11:15	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
deiseach (5,099 Posts)	A good deal less syrupy a letter than the one before it, which is no doubt going to draw down the ire of the soccer trolls who blame the GAA for all their woes: EVEN though I agree with M O Crualaoich’s opinion (Letters, September 8 ) that hurling is a great game, he and others shouldn`t bury their heads in the sand in relation to the current state of the game. The fact is that for the last few years the hurling championship has been very boring and the lack of competitive nature has turned a lot of fans away, as attendances this year would suggest. The last 12 All-Ireland hurling championships have been won by one of the Big Three (Kilkenny, Cork and Tipperary ) and it looks unlikely that this trend will be reversed in the near future. People in the GAA need to stop clapping themselves on the back about how great hurling is and get out and promote the game. They need to improve standards across Ireland, so that hopefully the hurling championship can return to a much more competitive era, such as it was during the 1990s. Darragh Farrell Daingean, Co Offaly
Darragh Farrell (368 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 11:24	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Darragh Farrell (368 Posts)	Fact is large swathes of the country are in thrall to the garrison game of soccer. Of the 32 counties in the country, hurling is only played to a decent standard in 4-5.
Rebel CNC (4,232 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 11:30	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Rebel CNC (4,232 Posts)	Originally posted by Darragh Farrell: Fact is large swathes of the country are in thrall to the garrison game of soccer. Of the 32 counties in the country, hurling is only played to a decent standard in 4-5. How bad. Something like 300 countries enter the garrison game world cup but only six or seven have a chance of winning it. In the English football league, of 92 clubs, only 4 or 5 (max ) have any chance of winning it in next 10 years.
hard shoulder (323 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 11:40	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
hard shoulder (323 Posts)	Fully agree with letter writer. At no other time in history has the game been so dominated by the big 3. This has been helped by 5 subs rul, which allows the counties with the higher playing populations to have more options while fundamentally discriminating against the ones with lower playing poulations.It could also be argued that doing things like playing the u21 final in Thurles helps stronger counties while discriminating against weaker ones. Contrary to all the bull\\ spoken that this was the final everyone wanted it most certainly was not. The final everyone wanted was something like Laois/Dublin/Wexford Vs Clare//Waterford or Kerry or better still Mayo vs Donegal. This might show that hurling is making real inroads rather than the crisis it`s in in many counties. Also why not have the Christy Ring or Lory Meaghar cups as a curtain raiser on All Irl day? Kilkenny minors will have loads of opportunity to cheer their teams or hurl for their teams on senior final day. Plus the minor final will draw a big crowd without the crutch of being before the senior final.
offaly (5,633 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 11:41	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
offaly (5,633 Posts)	He is correct, as much as I love hurling the fact is the GAA have failed in promoting it across the length and breath of Ireland.The hurling championship has been very predictable for the last few years and I have switched off a huge ampunt of games in the last couple of years before the end duie to the one sided nature of the contests.The attendances have been poor this year and you cant blame the economy for that as you only have to make a comparison with the football attendances. Quarter Finals: Hurling 27000, football 47000 and 61000 Semi Finals: Hurling 47000 and 40000 football 58000 and 82000 Same trend applies for the provincial finals where we had a poor turnout at teh munster hurling final and even though teh Leinster final had a good crowd it was well below the attendance for the football equivalent. The hurling championship today compared to the 1990`s is very uncompetitive and the gap betweenthe stong and the weak is getting larger and larger Limerick,Offaly,Wexford counties who were very good in the 90`s are miles behind tehse days and Clare have potential to get better because of their good underage teams but they are also miles behind, Dublin have improved but are still well off the pace in terms of winning all irelands.Hurling people spend far too much time sayong how great the game is rather than doing what the GAA should be doing which i promoting the game across all 32 counties the fact is in 126 years of the GAA only 10 counties are playing hurling at a decent level and that is a massive failure of the GAA in my opinion. This message has been edited - 09-sep-2010 @ 11:42
twiceasnice97 (9,233 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 11:51	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
twiceasnice97 (9,233 Posts)	this is how it has always been bar the 90s when clare limerick waterford and wexford all began to improve at the same time. by the way daragh, it has nothing to do with soccer. the major stumbling block to the spread of hurling is gaelic football and golf. one for attitude and two for the distraction of lads that could be coaching
Avondhu abu (1,215 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 11:57	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Avondhu abu (1,215 Posts)	I think it will always be the position where a few top counties will dominate with an occasion title going to the next four or five in the rankings. From my viewpoint I would be satisfied if I thought that any young lad in whatever county would be given the opprtuinty to play hurling. The onus is on non hurling counties to get their act together and promote the game and rovide competitions at whatever standard. Participation is more important than success
twiceasnice97 (9,233 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 12:00	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
twiceasnice97 (9,233 Posts)	Originally posted by offaly: Clare have potential to get better because of their good underage teams but they are also miles behind, . i wouldnt agree with that fully. once underage structures are producing players and correct management is in place teams tend to improve rapidly. tipp are a case in point. sh1t under babs and now three years on the outstanding side in the country. clares under 21s went toe to toe with this group of tipp players twice in the last three under 21 championships. they lost both days but did not look out of their depth against them in any way and in darach honan and conor mcgrath we appear to have two of the most talented young forwards in the country coming through. honan is a unique talent and mcgrath was the best forward on display in this years munster championship despite tipps undoubted excellence at the grade. both are underage again next year there is no great need for the pessimism regarding our chances so long as the underage structures continue to go in the direction that has been taken and that we continue to involve people of the quality of sean o halloran, john minogue, cyril lyons donal molony gerry o connor and all the coachs that have contributed to producing players with the confidence and skill that we are seeing. the striking thing for me about the last few seasons is the fact that we are achieving things with sides that are in general better hurling teams than their opponents rather than bigger or more committed
Seamus McSpud (990 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 12:00	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Seamus McSpud (990 Posts)	Hurling has never has been at a lower ebb. The Big 3 have won the last 12 All Ireland`s. The previous longest consecutive run of All Ireland wins by the Big 3 was 8 from 1902-09 and there were runs of 7 from 1941-47 & 1961-67. As a previous poster has alluded to, five substitution rule and also the backdoor system have effectively copperfastened a perpetual dominance by the bluebloods of the game. Galway look like the only county that could break the stranglehold of the Big 3 but that`s been predicted every year for the past 22 years and they`ve never really got close to doing so. Waterford look like they are in for a lean time as they enter a period of transition, though there are some glimmers of hope there at underage level. Limerick has been lost completely to infighting and rugby, Wexford looks lost to junior soccer and general apathy and Offaly & Clare have been very weak for a while too.
offaly (5,633 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 12:00	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
offaly (5,633 Posts)	If ye think Darragh Farrell from this site is the Darragh Farrell who wrote that letter then ye are mistaken
Plain of the Herbs (301 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 12:05	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Plain of the Herbs (301 Posts)	"Daingean man finds hurling boring" shock. Originally posted by deiseach: `Darragh Farrell` in the Indo today, raining on the hurling parade
offaly (5,633 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 12:08	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
offaly (5,633 Posts)	Originally posted by Plain of the Herbs: "Daingean man finds hurling boring" shock. The hurling championship has been boring for the last few years and there is no denying it whether you come from Daingean or any other part of county Offaly.By the way that letter writer said that he found hurling to be a great game. This message has been edited - 09-sep-2010 @ 12:15
Plain of the Herbs (301 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 12:16	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Plain of the Herbs (301 Posts)	It depends what you`re looking for when you`re watching your hurling. I think hurling has never been better, has never been played with such a skill level and at such pace and intensity at the top level. That`s what I look for anyway. Originally posted by offaly: The hurling championship has been boring for the last few years and there is no denying it whether you come from Daingean or any other part of county Offaly.
offaly (5,633 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 12:19	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
offaly (5,633 Posts)	Originally posted by Plain of the Herbs: It depends what you`re looking for when you`re watching your hurling. I think hurling has never been better, has never been played with such a skill level and at such pace and intensity at the top level. That`s what I look for anyway. The skill is top notch and some individual games are brilliant but what alot of people look for in a championship is competitiveness and sadly that has been lacking for the last fwew years.It isnt much fun looking at brilliant displays of skill when the result of the match is inevitable and as John Henderson said on the Sunday Game a few weeks back people probably prefer a tight match than one which may have loads of skill but lack competitveness
Half Forward (822 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 12:23	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Half Forward (822 Posts)	I have posted regularly in the past about the falling standard of club hurling in Clare and across most of the country. Too many senior clubs who cannot genuinely compete at senior A grade. Meaningless leagues in most counties, except Kilkenny where the top 2 in the leagues get bye to championship quarter finals. I totally agree that the back door system suits the bigger counties but criticising the 5 substitute rule is a nonsense in my opinion. The real problem there is that some counties don`t act fast enough when they have 5 subs available to them. Look at the minor final last Sunday, Clare ran out of steam all over the pitch yet only 3 subs were introduced. I am not going to criticise individual young players who all tried their best but while some were magnificent, others struggled, which happens in every team. Kilkenny, while only using 3 subs too, acted earlier and got back in to the match. As for attendances, that is mostly down to Dublin staying in the football championship for so long.
blaaboy (111 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 12:28	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
blaaboy (111 Posts)	The simple fact is that hurling has always been dominated by the big three - that is why they are referred to as such, because of the number of All Ireland`s they have won. The backdoor system is the reason that these big three have dominated the All Ireland for the last 10 years and us lesser counties have failed to make the breakthrough. The only underdog to really avail of the back door were Offaly and that was when it only applied to beaten Munster and Leinster finalists. The chances of beating KK once in the last five years was slim never mind having to beat them a second time. Take 2004 when Waterford had beaten Cork in Munster and Wexford had beaten KK in Leinster, under the old regime the AI winners that year would have come from Waterford Wexford, Antrim or Galway, instead it was played between Cork & KK. The backdoor is not about giving underdogs a second chance, it works in favour of the strong counties and is about trying to get more high profile games and money for the GAA. Personally I think it would be better to return to the old straight knock out format for the All Ireland and promote the League to a summer competition run at the same time as the AI series. With the amount of training and challenge games being played by counties, it would make little difference to the club scene, and with players in peak condition and mad to play, the league would be much more presitgious, instead of build up in the mud. Hurling is still very much a specialist sport that requires holding a hurley daily in your hand. It is no coincidence that the big three come from very large widespread counties where GAA is still the major rural occpation. This will always be hard to break. Huge work is being done at underage level in different counties but the competition in Urban areas with other sports is fierce. For example here in Waterford - Dessie Hutchinson was a star on the Tony Forristal winning U-14 team, he was also player of the year for Waterford Soccer team the same year and this type of confrontation is commonplace. I do feel that the GAA could do much more to promote Hurling in the lesser counties, but even looking at the way Croke Park took many of lesser counties away from the Tony Forristal Tournament in Waterford to me shows a lack of vision in promoting hurling accross the country. But the question is often asked is, do the big three want the game promoted elsewhere or would they rather preserve it for their tradition. Would the big three really like to see a situation where Clare, Waterford Limerick etc, came to force and started reducing their championship wins. Looking at many comments on here, many of them would be happy to just have it in their own back yard all the time, treating with distain the efforts of other counties trying hard to make the break through. .
cypher (419 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 12:30	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
cypher (419 Posts)	Darach Honan wouldn`t be with in asses roar of the Tipp Panel. Tipp gave clare a 6 point start, after 3 minutes and won pulling up by 6 in the Munster Final. Stop deluding yourself twicey.
cypher (419 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 12:31	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
cypher (419 Posts)	Originally posted by offaly: If ye think Darragh Farrell from this site is the Darragh Farrell who wrote that letter then ye are mistaken ??? What can this mean?
Plain of the Herbs (301 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 12:33	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Plain of the Herbs (301 Posts)	That`s fair enough, I`m happy that we`ll agree to differ on that. I would point out though that both Munster Finals, though the results were in doubt up to the end were horrendous games of hurling, in my view. Originally posted by offaly:The skill is top notch and some individual games are brilliant but what alot of people look for in a championship is competitiveness and sadly that has been lacking for the last fwew years.It isnt much fun looking at brilliant displays of skill when the result of the match is inevitable and as John Henderson said on the Sunday Game a few weeks back people probably prefer a tight match than one which may have loads of skill but lack competitveness
offaly (5,633 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 12:35	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
offaly (5,633 Posts)	Originally posted by Half Forward: As for attendances, that is mostly down to Dublin staying in the football championship for so long. If you take Dublin out of the eqaution. All Ireland Semi Finals: Football 58000, hurling 49000 and 41000 Quarter Finals:Football 47000 Hurling 27000 Munster Final Hurling: 35000 and 22000 ,Football Leinster Final: Hurling: 31000 Football:48000 This message has been edited - 09-sep-2010 @ 12:35
offaly (5,633 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 12:37	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
offaly (5,633 Posts)	Originally posted by Plain of the Herbs: That`s fair enough, I`m happy that we`ll agree to differ on that. I would point out though that both Munster Finals, though the results were in doubt up to the end were horrendous games of hurling, in my view. what I like is a bit of both, skill and a tight match.Even though the munster finals were dreadful games of hurling they were more enjoyable than the KK Cork AI semi final and other such hammerings that we have seen dished out this year.
rebeloreilly (152 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 13:17	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
rebeloreilly (152 Posts)	As mentioned by one poster get rid of the back door in hurling. On any given day any team can be beaten, but give a team like Kk a second chance and of course they`ll still have huge chance of winning it out. Even for the weaker side going into a big clash, the same bite isn`t in the player when he knows no one will be too upset if the lose and they have another chance anyway too.
Chuck Norris (475 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 13:27	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
Chuck Norris (475 Posts)	Originally posted by offaly: He is correct, as much as I love hurling the fact is the GAA have failed in promoting it across the length and breath of Ireland.The hurling championship has been very predictable for the last few years and I have switched off a huge ampunt of games in the last couple of years before the end duie to the one sided nature of the contests.The attendances have been poor this year and you cant blame the economy for that as you only have to make a comparison with the football attendances. Quarter Finals: Hurling 27000, football 47000 and 61000 Semi Finals: Hurling 47000 and 40000 football 58000 and 82000 Worse still, there was 63,000 at second football semi-final
knightset (758 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 13:41	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
knightset (758 Posts)	Originally posted by Rebel CNC: How bad. Something like 300 countries enter the garrison game world cup but only six or seven have a chance of winning it. In the English football league, of 92 clubs, only 4 or 5 (max ) have any chance of winning it in next 10 years. 300 countries!! Think you`ll find it`s just over 200 as that is the amount of countires in the world.
EastStand (6,332 Posts)	Posted: 09-Sep-2010 13:52	Quote Edit Delete Report Post Post Reply
EastStand (6,332 Posts)	Originally posted by cypher: Darach Honan wouldn`t be with in asses roar of the Tipp Panel. Tipp gave clare a 6 point start, after 3 minutes and won pulling up by 6 in the Munster Final. Stop deluding yourself twicey. So are you telling me that Darach Honan would not be a better addition to that tipp team than John O`Brien say?

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